Camera PV 2007 » Digital Camera » Ethical question
Ethical question
Question:
} }} I would, of course, save Jerry because I differentiate between }} Jerry, the person, and his many unfortunate posts here. }} }} I do this for several reasons. Jerry is a human and I don’t believe in }} free-will. } }A fellow determinist I see. My studies in psychology were only on the BS }(which translates to you know what) level, but it seems the psych and }philosophy folks eventually come to this conclusion.
Yep! } }} Perhaps, if we shared Jerry’s genes and were exposed to the same kind of }} environment as Jerry, we would all behave like him. 
} }But aren’t there other determining factors than genes and environment – how }else do you explain precognitive dreams? What a mix I am – a Jungian }determinist : ).
What, by definition, is a "precognitive dream"? }} There but for the genetic and environmental contingencies go I! } }And is there a force of nature that determines the genetic and environmental }contingencies? So there but for the hypothetical will of nature go I.
And may that "will of nature" forever keep you and sustain you dear Adrienne, and your lovely pets. –Marshall PS: I would rather being schmoozing about this, than fantasizing Jerry’s death. :-)
Response:
>> I would, of course, save Jerry because I differentiate between > Jerry, the person, and his many unfortunate posts here. > I do this for several reasons. Jerry is a human and I don’t believe in > free-will.
Call me a free will kind of guy, Doc. Because if I were a determinist, Jerry Howe would probably already be dead. >A fellow determinist I see. My studies in psychology were only on the BS >(which translates to you know what) level, but it seems the psych and >philosophy folks eventually come to this conclusion.
Most of the psychs and philos I’ve ever known have been free-will kinds of guys and gals. > Perhaps, if we shared Jerry’s genes and were exposed to the same kind of > environment as Jerry, we would all behave like him.
Then we should *all* be drowned. >But aren’t there other determining factors than genes and environment – how >else do you explain precognitive dreams?
How ’bout happenstance? Do you "believe" in UFOs, too? Sorry…I’m mostly a logical positivist. >What a mix I am – a Jungian determinist : ).
There are several new drugs that might help you, Adrienne. There are *always* new drugs. Geeeeeeeeez. > There but for the genetic and environmental contingencies go I! >And is there a force of nature that determines the genetic and environmental >contingencies?
No. But liberals keep looking for one…i.e., an excuse for own their shortcomings. :>( — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
>>If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being >swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or >getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down >the river… >What shutter speed would you use? >The shutter speed is irrelevant,
The shutter speed is *never* irrelevant, Cindy. You’d want the motion of the raging river water to be just a little blurred, wouldn’t you? >because it’s cruel and only used by >the lyingdirtyfolks who like to torture cameras while pretending to be >concerned for their welfare. >Admit it, you only like to twist knobs >and pinch lenses until the poor creature pisses on itself.
That’s true…I am a gadget freak. Especially gadgets that have been lost, abandoned, or thrown away simply because their owners couldn’t figure out how to get them to work. I really enjoy fixing them up, good as new, in fact. Most folks just throw away their broken gadgets. That’s why I think shutter speed is so important. >Drop dead.
Got milk? — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
[...] > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from > being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him > or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept > down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use? > :>) >Well I know this was a facetious question,but…
No, actually it wasn’t. Shutter speed is very important. You wouldn’t want this picture to be blurred, would you? >First off it bugs me when people are taking pictures of tragedy.
Jerry drowning is no tragedy, it’s pretty much a cause for *celebration,* in my opinion. >When something bad is happening to you, your home, your boat…well >Let me tell you this story.
[...] No thanks. >Actually, I would rescue him : )
And spoil a really good celebration? How sad. :>( — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
>Dogman writes: >If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe >struggling to keep from being swept away in a >raging river and you had a choice of rescuing >him or getting a Pulitzer prize-winning >photograph of him as he is swept down the >river… >Being the humanitarian that I am…….
That’s okay, Fred, Jerry isn’t a human being. You’re off the hook. >I’d definetly have to save him.
Just so you could kick his ass later? >I’d know that there would have to be ‘absolutely no force-none >whatsoever’, so we couldn’t touch him. I’d do a little sound >distraction, then take out a ball and offer to have a game of "fetch" >with him. I’m sure he’d be safe in no time.
That’s what I thought…you’d watch him float away, too. :>) — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >x-no-archive:yes > I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary > situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would > do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood > in progress. > Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and > infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting > still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for > particularly poignant scenes. > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use? > :>) > Dogman >I can’t control the shutter speed on the digital camera so I’d probably >get a shot of him holding on — then another shot of him floating away!!
That’s pretty much what I’d do, too, Ken. But only after I took a piss in the river, of course. — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >: I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary >: situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would >: do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood >: in progress. >: Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and >: infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting >: still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for >: particularly poignant scenes. >: If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being >: swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or >: getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down >: the river… >: What shutter speed would you use? >: :>) >You know that Springer Spaniel I shouldn’t have saved because after all >jumping into a dog fight between unknown dogs was really dangerous and I >might have gotten hurt of even killed?
Yes, I remember it well, Diane. >I’ve learned my lesson.
Is the lessen "What goes around comes around" by any chance? >If it’s >dangerous to jump in and help I should just let nature take its course.
Before or after you pissed in the river? ;>) — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
>> Actually, I would rescue him : ) >So would I : )
That’s unfortunate, Adrienne. >Here’s another ethical question. If both me and one of my dogs were drowning >who would you try to save first?
Does this event happen before or after I learn that you would try to save Jerry Howe’s life? ;>) — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
I’d save him, because I’ve always wanted to be a candidate for sainthood. :-) Then, because I’ll never really be a candidate for sainthood, I’d smack him upside the head a few times with the camera. Denna http://www.picantes.com/pitbull – The Real Pit Bull http://www.picantes.com/happythoughts – Pics from my exciting life http://www.picantes.com/windwolf – My art, pets, and twisted world view
Response:
> : Here’s another ethical question. If both me and one of my dogs were drowning > : who would you try to save first? > Oh, the dog undoubtedly, because you’d kill me if I let harm come to one > of your dogs. 
I’d probably just mutter something melodramatic under my breath like "what’s the use of going on without my dog" and then jump back in the river : ) Adrienne Gremlin, Bruno, Lewis, Yoko, Freneau John Muir, "Stickeen: The Story of a Dog" http://www.sierraclub.org/john_muir_exhibit/writings/stickeen/the_sto… (In memory of Pepe, Pepper, Cinder, Rascal, Tucker, Max, Hubble and Puppy)
Response:
> > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use?
1/60 or even 1/30. Jerry has never been terribly clear, so the blurring effect of shooting a thrashing subject with a low shutter speed would invoke the same "what the hell?" response as reading a Howe message. Artistically,
Response:
> I’ve learned my lesson. If it’s >dangerous to jump in and help I should just let nature take its course.
ROFL, you guys are too funny….. Dogstar716 Come see Gunnars Life: http://www.angelfire.com/ut/Gunnar " I AM a lunatic, and I AM obsessed with this business" – Jerry Howe
Response:
>: If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being >: swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or >: getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down >: the river… >: What shutter speed would you use?
I would, of course, save Jerry because I differentiate between Jerry, the person, and his many unfortunate posts here. I do this for several reasons. Jerry is a human and I don’t believe in free-will. Perhaps, if we shared Jerry’s genes and were exposed to the same kind of environment as Jerry, we would all behave like him. There but for the genetic and environmental contingencies go I! –Marshall
Response:
Quote: If both me and one of my dogs were drowning who would you try to save first? The dog. (Sorry.) I’d figure the person could swim or take verbal directions. Also — I originally heard the story, not about Jerry Howe, but about Bill Clinton. Works either way. Jane Webb Mudpie & Moonpie
Response:
Dogman writes: >If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe >struggling to keep from being swept away in a >raging river and you had a choice of rescuing >him or getting a Pulitzer prize-winning >photograph of him as he is swept down the >river…
Being the humanitarian that I am…….I’d definetly have to save him. I’d know that there would have to be ‘absolutely no force-none whatsoever’, so we couldn’t touch him. I’d do a little sound distraction, then take out a ball and offer to have a game of "fetch" with him. I’m sure he’d be safe in no time. FRED HASSEN (702) 877-4581 "SIT MEANS SIT" Internet obedience talkshow can be found at: http://www.fredhassen.com Trainer/Owner–1999 N.A.P.D.(Open) National Champion "Obedience" 1999 N.A.P.D. (Open) National Champion "Protection" All-time high obedience score record holder for N.A.P.D. competitions Monthly articles appear in Dog Sports Magazine www.dogsports.com Monthly column appears at www.tritronics.com/pvo/p_ia_01.html For Discussion board see: www.tritronics.com/pvo/p_dg_01.html
Response:
: I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary : situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would : do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood : in progress. : Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and : infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting : still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for : particularly poignant scenes. : If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being : swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or : getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down : the river… : What shutter speed would you use? : :>) You know that Springer Spaniel I shouldn’t have saved because after all jumping into a dog fight between unknown dogs was really dangerous and I might have gotten hurt of even killed? I’ve learned my lesson. If it’s dangerous to jump in and help I should just let nature take its course. Diane Blackman _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ Life is too short to be fretful.
Response:
> I would, of course, save Jerry because I differentiate between > Jerry, the person, and his many unfortunate posts here. > I do this for several reasons. Jerry is a human and I don’t believe in > free-will.
A fellow determinist I see. My studies in psychology were only on the BS (which translates to you know what) level, but it seems the psych and philosophy folks eventually come to this conclusion. > Perhaps, if we shared Jerry’s genes and were exposed to the same kind of > environment as Jerry, we would all behave like him.
But aren’t there other determining factors than genes and environment – how else do you explain precognitive dreams? What a mix I am – a Jungian determinist : ). > There but for the genetic and environmental contingencies go I!
And is there a force of nature that determines the genetic and environmental contingencies? So there but for the hypothetical will of nature go I. — Adrienne Gremlin, Bruno, Lewis, Yoko, Freneau John Muir, "Stickeen: The Story of a Dog" http://www.sierraclub.org/john_muir_exhibit/writings/stickeen/the_sto… (In memory of Pepe, Pepper, Cinder, Rascal, Tucker, Max, Hubble and Puppy)
Response:
> Actually, I would rescue him : )
So would I : ) Here’s another ethical question. If both me and one of my dogs were drowning who would you try to save first? — Adrienne Gremlin, Bruno, Lewis, Yoko, Freneau John Muir, "Stickeen: The Story of a Dog" http://www.sierraclub.org/john_muir_exhibit/writings/stickeen/the_sto… (In memory of Pepe, Pepper, Cinder, Rascal, Tucker, Max, Hubble, Puppy and Henry Young)
Response:
: Here’s another ethical question. If both me and one of my dogs were drowning : who would you try to save first? Oh, the dog undoubtedly, because you’d kill me if I let harm come to one of your dogs. Diane Blackman Read the puppy reports http://www.dog-play.com/report.html – – - - - - - - – "Much of the tension [a dog] experiences results from fear — the more confidence he gains, the less fearful he will be; the less fearful, the less tension and stress he needs to dissipate." "The Body Language and Emotion of Dogs" by Myrna M. Milani, DVM.
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clicker training-sound distraction–smile click-click-click-click. LOL
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – >I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary >situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would >do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood >in progress. >Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and >infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting >still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for >particularly poignant scenes. >If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being >swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or >getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down >the river… >What shutter speed would you use?
The slowest possible and focus on the black boxes he has strapped to both ears mickey mouse fashion. Isn’t that howe he would like to be last seen? Cheers Dave Diduck, a Collector and Connoisseur of Opinions 1123 Fort St Regina Sk S4T 5R9 Ph: 306-949-8359 Fax: 306-543-3999 http://www.cableregina.com/users/ddiduck/
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snip > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use?
Bwahahahaha!!!!Er… um… shouldn’t one be using a camcorder? BG! Terri
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary >situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would >do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood >in progress. >Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and >infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting >still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for >particularly poignant scenes. >If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being >swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or >getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down >the river… >What shutter speed would you use? > :>)
I wouldn’t bother with taking a picture…I would throw him one of his little black boxes.
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary > situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one > would > do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge > flood > in progress. > Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and > infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out > getting > still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for > particularly poignant scenes. > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from > being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him > or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept > down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use? > :>)
Well I know this was a facetious question,but… First off it bugs me when people are taking pictures of tragedy. When something bad is happening to you, your home, your boat…well Let me tell you this story. During the No Name storm of 93 : ( we lost our barn,about a dozen centuries old trees,some destruction of our shack, (we were VERY lucky) as over 10 were swept away,with no trace,and much devastation to our home and grounds. : ( Afterwards,people were coming around GAWKING and taking pics. Well during the storm, we were trying to save one of the fishing boats. My husband and the crew, were risking their lives.as the boat was battling the rocks,and these guys were giving it their all for the boat not to go down. How would you like it having people shooting flashes in your face, and smiling, when you are fighting with everything you have from losing your livlihood? I never saw my husband so mad, as when he came back to the dock,grabbed this little weasel,and grabbed the film out of his camera! Yes I know that there are some great pics and stories that have come from disasters. BUT when you are the one the pictures are of,well,you think a lot differently. As for Jerry,well I hope that black box of his can be used as a life ring! Actually, I would rescue him : ) Paulette~ * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet’s Discussion Network * The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet – Free!
Response:
I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood in progress. Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for particularly poignant scenes. If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down the river… What shutter speed would you use? :>) — Dogman http://www.i1.net/~dogman For everything you’ve ever wanted to know about Jerry Howe and other trolls and scumbags, go here: http://www.i1.net/~dogman/trolls.html Nicholas Regush/ABC News column: Ritalin — Misdirected Attention Disorder? http://more.abcnews.go.com/sections/living/secondopinion/secondopinio… "Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers." Bernhard Haisch
Response:
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -> I have an ethical question for all of you. This is an imaginary > situation, of course, but I think it is fun to decide what one would > do. The situation: You are in the Midwest, and there is a huge flood > in progress. > Many homes have been lost, water supplies compromised, and > infrastructure destroyed. Let’s say you’re a photographer out getting > still photos for a news service, traveling alone, looking for > particularly poignant scenes. > If you were to stumble across Jerry Howe struggling to keep from being > swept away in a raging river and you had a choice of rescuing him or > getting a Pulitzer prize-winning photograph of him as he is swept down > the river… > What shutter speed would you use? > :>)
Harlan is somewhat troubled by the prospect of all that baloney being wasted on catfish and other bottom-feeders. –Terri & Harlan (concerned) — At least, I have integrity, and admission of my insanity, is proof of my credibility. –Jerry "Reality is Overrated" Howe 11/4/99 Before you buy.